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The twisted 'truth' on Ukraine

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Posted By: DVC, 3/17/2022 7:48:27 PM

I couldn't believe my eyes when I read in AT the recent article by Dan Truitt on the Russian invasion in Ukraine. Almost word by word, it repeated the Russian propaganda that is being fed by the "Ministry of Truth" in Moscow. Mr. Truitt claims that "virtually no one in the U.S. has got this right, including conservative outlets and pundits." What arrogance! By these words, he claims a possession of the ultimate knowledge of the roots and causes of the current events. Really?

Comments:

Mr. Fradan's take on the facts fits well with what I learned from a decade of traveling to and doing business in Russia, Ukraine and several other former soviet states.

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Reply 1 - Posted by: LadyHen 3/17/2022 8:23:18 PM (No. 1102901)
I make no comments regarding the veracity of ANYTHING any press agents of either side says about this war. I find myself believing no one, a stance no soul has been able to dissuade me of as of yet. I do not like being emotionally manipulated by anyone. That is all the press does now. And a people led around with a ring of "feelings" firmly hooked in it's nose deserves the abattoir it gets. That said.. fta: "In 2005, Putin called disintegration of the USSR "a geopolitical catastrophe" and aimed his efforts at restoring his country in the Soviet borders of 1945." No, he wishes to restore Russia to it's Imperial Tsarist stature, sphere of influence, and power, a pipe dream for which his people and many others will suffer sadly. I don't pretend to know Putin's motives, I doubt they are pure and noble though I am sure he will couch them in patriotism just as George Bush and son did to us. Goodness knows, we can't be the bad guys ever, right? I do however wish the Old Cold Warriors (both here and all over the web) would try just once to stop thinking of Russia as the USSR. Imperial Tsarist (as in Caesar) Russia existed and was ruled over by the exact same family for 300 years, that is far longer than the Evil Empire existed. It's influence in the Slavic world can not be understated. Why would Putin seek to recreate a weak failed Communist system that died in less than 100 years when his nation has a "glorious" Imperial history on which to hitch his star and a history for which we know he and his people are very proud. Also, I am Orthodox Christian. I have met many many Slavs (many Russian and Ukrainians among them) in a very intimate spiritual way, not work relationships, not as a foreigners visiting their country, not as adversaries but as a fellow Christian worshipping our Risen Lord Jesus. Some of the horrendous characterizations I have seen on this website by some proposed experts concerning them is simply beyond ignorance, bordering on bigotry but is also incredibly un-Christian. There are many many fine Christian men and women in Russia (and Ukraine) and many clergy gave their lives to fight Communist. The comment someone made that the entirety of the clergy in the USSR were KGB was appalling for those of us who know and have know Russian clergy who went to gulags, who suffered in hiding, who risked death baptizing people and giving communion in secret, who hid icons on pain of death as well, who fed their sheep from the last crumbs left on their table. They weren't soft pampered Christians with plenty who now open their churches to sexual idolatry and perversion and sacrifice their children on the altar of wokeness. Wake up. The world has changed since the 60's and 70's. It is not the evil we see that we should fear the most. It is those who have been pulling the invisible strings the past 2+ years that we should dread. I refuse to be their puppet but if enough "Conservatives" are gulled into the ruse out of some bigotry and misguided patriotism, the West will fall.
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Reply 2 - Posted by: DVC 3/17/2022 9:51:52 PM (No. 1102967)
I only tell what Christians who lived in Soviet times have told me about the church leaders and priests that they knew of. It is impossible for me to know that personally, because it happened years before, but I can report what a was told to me by people who lived through it. I did visit two monasteries which were being rebuilt from bare, rootless brick walls by monks clearly committed to their vows, living as in the 1800s or older. Whether a national church Russian Orthodox leader is a real Christian or as phony politicians as the national leaders of my own Methodist church, I don't know. But it was clear that the monks were truly committed to their vows. And with the current Roman pope being a apparently communist and seemingly not interested the same things as his predecessors , how impossible does other similar political posers seem? I have no doubt that broad generalities, even if approximately true in the 60s and 70s, will always have exceptions then and may even be seriously outdated by the 2000s when I was there.
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Reply 3 - Posted by: MDConservative 3/17/2022 10:23:48 PM (No. 1102990)
#1 - "I find myself believing no one, a stance no soul has been able to dissuade me of as of yet. I do not like being emotionally manipulated by anyone. That is all the press does now. And a people led around with a ring of "feelings" firmly hooked in it's nose deserves the abattoir it gets." I totally agree. This is another propaganda avalanche here no side has a monopoly on "truth". For example, how many Ukrainians (presumably soldiers, partisan fighters, and civilians as there was no break out provided) have been confirmed dead in this conflict through 15 March? The answer, according to the UN WHO is 692...not thousands, and certainly no indication of indiscriminate slaughter. I have been to Russia several times myself, the first time in 1982. I have literally traveled from the western border through Siberia. I also passed through the Iron Curtain on several occasions in those days. Russian military might, excluding nukes, is second rate. Its society outside the urban centers borders on primitive in many ways. Historically they have never been able to project power beyond its borders except pursuing a spent enemy, such as the Nazi Wehrmacht or Napoleon's retreating Grand Armee. The US has no business in exporting "freedom", in other words nation building. We are insane to think we can even do so, even as occupiers. We never learn. George Washington warned against perpetual alliances and involvement in foreign intrigues. NATO, after 75 years, and Ukraine today are perfect examples of his things to avoid. I join #1 wishing the Old Cold Warriors (both here and all over the web) would try just once to stop thinking of Russia as the USSR.
9 people like this.

Reply 4 - Posted by: FormerDem 3/17/2022 11:52:37 PM (No. 1103014)
Thanks for this, OP. I can't get over the people claiming it is all actors or something. Our satellites know exactly what is happening, and not just ours - it is also the spy agencies of Poland, the UK, Hungary, France. They don't agree about anything usually. Best I can tell, people are trying hard to stay in yesterday, the same allies, the same analyses. Something about a vine and branches comes to mind. ... As for the Orthodox, yes they have holy priests! There is that wonderful Hilarion. I am mad at Kirill because the one soul he might save and nobody else can, is Putin's, and Kirill has other priorities. Nobody else can tell Putin he is wrong. Kirill could have and does not. If Putin goes to hell for this, it is Kirill's fault also. What I want is, we all go to Heaven and the Holy Spirit shows the Ukrainians how to rebuild their cities to be more beautiful than ever before, in new ways we cannot even think of yet. Don't laugh... Maybe..
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Reply 5 - Posted by: beancounter 3/18/2022 5:54:03 AM (No. 1103098)
I think what we’re seeing is a civil war in Ukraine. Western Ukraine wants to align with Europe and Eastern Ukraine wants to align with Russia. Since the coup, ethnic Russians have been driven out of Ukraine. This gave Putin the excuse to send in the army.
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