Change to 737 MAX controls may have imperiled planes, experts say
Reuters,
by
Alwyn Scott
&
Eric M. Johnson
Original Article
Posted By: earlybird,
3/22/2019 5:44:19 PM
NEW YORK/SEATTLE - Much like tapping the brake pedal in a car to disengage cruise control, a sharp tug on the controls of older models of Boeing Co’s 737 used to shut off an automatic trim system that keeps the plane flying level, giving the pilot control.But Boeing disabled the “yoke jerk” function when it brought out the 737 MAX, the latest version of its top-selling jet - and many pilots were unaware of the change (Snip)A pair of switches on the center console between the pilots will turn off the automatic trim
Reply 1 - Posted by:
earlybird 3/22/2019 5:46:00 PM (No. 9595)
That pair of switches would also have turned off the Maneuver Characteristics Augmentation System, or MCAS, that is suspected of playing a role in both disasters.
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Reply 2 - Posted by:
DVC 3/22/2019 6:41:24 PM (No. 9598)
Just exactly like a runaway pitch trim system, and the pilots should have been trained to understand and recognize this potential failure. Pitch trim runaway is a known kind of very critical failure, but a good pilot knows how to kill the trim system power.
The removal of the ´jerk to disconnect´ autopilot feature without the pilots clearly understanding this change is a serious training failure. Sounds like the MCAS disconnect should be on the yoke right next to the autopilot disconnect.
This seems at this point to be a training failure, pilots unaware of what the aircraft is doing, and how to stop it when the system has a critical sensor failure. Whether that is on Boeing or on the airlines, I don´t know. Boeing does not control the training that airlines require on aircraft owned by the airlines.
Ultimately, there is a requirement (whether it is written in law or not) that the pilots be well trained and understand the flight systems, and how all of it works, and how to deal with reasonably predictable sorts of failures.
This one needs to be a simulator training failure item, for sure, get the pilots familiar with the feel of this failure and how to stop it. And, I am sure, after this, that it will be included by any good airlines with good sim operators.
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Reply 3 - Posted by:
Ken M. 3/22/2019 6:58:46 PM (No. 9601)
#2 is correct. From what we know so far, this is looking more like a pilot awareness/training issue.
I worked on Flight Sims (KC-135) in the USAF in the 60s, and there were several aircraft mods during my time, that also had to be done to the simulators.
One that comes to mind is the powered rudder. There were occasional instances of the rudder going hard over to one side or other. First we had to modify the simulators cockpit controls for the powered rudder; then we later had to install the failure mode for the instructor to use on his pilots.
Again, from what little we know so far, this appears to be shaping up as a pilot training issue.
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Reply 4 - Posted by:
earlybird 3/22/2019 9:41:50 PM (No. 9600)
Pilot training….Ethiopia….Indonesia….thousands of other flights in these planes without incident. And maybe, just maybe, the other airlines sprung for the extra bucks to have Boeing install the light and other control that is described in this and other articles.
Corner cutting. Sloppy, lax training….
I thought this from the beginning. The training part. I am not surprised at this development.
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Reply 5 - Posted by:
Rumblehog 3/22/2019 10:23:26 PM (No. 9593)
It´s too advanced an aircraft to be sold in third-world countries. That is NOT Boeing´s fault, however. Boeing doesn´t provide the crew training, the airlines do!
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Reply 6 - Posted by:
jjs 3/22/2019 11:01:52 PM (No. 9604)
Yoke jerk must of been part of their ox training before they were given pilots licences, they may have gotten confused. Not a lot of switches on those ox simulators.
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Reply 7 - Posted by:
DVC 3/23/2019 1:20:40 AM (No. 9597)
OK, I have now been in contact with two US airline pilots, both currently flying, not retired, one American Airlines, one SW. Both say that this is a training issue.
Of course. IMO, it is also a maintenance issue since the AOA sensor was faulty the day before and not fixed.
The SW pilot says SW has 80,000 trouble free hours in the 737-Max8 subvariant. He has flown it, and is not worried.
3rd world pilots, 3rd world maintenance, 3rd world airlines.
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Reply 8 - Posted by:
DVC 3/23/2019 1:22:19 AM (No. 9603)
Oh, and to clarify, both are 737 pilots, although one has now switched to MD80s, but flew 737s for many years.
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Reply 9 - Posted by:
hoosierblue 3/23/2019 8:23:57 AM (No. 9594)
Don´t the train pilots on new planes before the fly them. Sounds like criminal negligence.
7 people like this.
Reply 10 - Posted by:
franq 3/23/2019 8:54:26 AM (No. 9599)
What makes the better story? Poorly trained pilots or big,evil corporations that cost hundreds of people their lives?
8 people like this.
Reply 11 - Posted by:
ROLFNader 3/23/2019 9:10:21 AM (No. 9596)
Fortunately , I´m old enough that I won´t be forced into owning a self-driving car.
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Reply 12 - Posted by:
49 Ford 3/23/2019 10:31:51 AM (No. 9602)
As a layman I can grasp that this is probably a training issue, but might Boeing have unintentionally underemphasized the need for extra training? As I understand it they were competing for contracts with Airbus and the minimal need for further training was a selling point for the 737 Max. Just asking.
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