Time to Reinstate Bible Reading and Prayer
in Our Schools
American Thinker,
by
E. Jeffrey Ludwig
Original Article
Posted By: Imright,
11/10/2024 6:29:39 AM
In the late 1940s, Supreme Court Justice Hugo L. Black, in the case of Everson v. United States, took a quote from a letter written by Thomas Jefferson out of context and insisted that the wall of separation between church and state “should be high and impregnable.”
Despite some variability, this position became the basis for the Court’s interpretation of the separation of church and state which led to the banning of prayer and Bible reading in the public schools at the beginning of the 1960s.
Separation of church and state means (1) that taxes should not be used to support an official national church (denomination) of Christianity,
Post Reply
Reminder: “WE ARE A SALON AND NOT A SALOON”
Your thoughts, comments, and ideas are always welcome here. But we ask you to please be mindful and respectful. Threatening or crude language doesn't persuade anybody and makes the conversation less enjoyable for fellow L.Dotters.
Reply 1 - Posted by:
Philipsonh 11/10/2024 6:45:06 AM (No. 1830834)
I think NOT; that is what churches ( of all faiths ) are for. When I went to high school, students were allowed to leave an hour early one day a week to attend ( Christian ) religious classes, but NOT in the school building. Those that did not leave had a home room or library hour. Of course times were very different in the 1950's.
45 people like this.
Reply 2 - Posted by:
homefry 11/10/2024 7:07:13 AM (No. 1830848)
I dont know. Seems like long about the same time they kicked God out of school, the schools turned into bad places. I understand though that equal citizens who maybe dont believe the way others do, have their rights too.
11 people like this.
Reply 3 - Posted by:
franq 11/10/2024 7:23:21 AM (No. 1830862)
Wonderful idea, but I can't picture a leftist teacher doing justice to a Scripture reading.
Let's start by taking stuff OUT - sex indoctrination (starting in elementary school, for many), anti-American revised history, kids who refuse discipline, cell phones...
You catch my drift. Much work needs done.
Fortunately, there is home schooling and many fine private Christian schools where God is not ignored.
27 people like this.
Reply 4 - Posted by:
4Liberty2020 11/10/2024 7:31:34 AM (No. 1830869)
Having had Bible reading in my public school growing up in the late 50's and 60's, we had no discipline problems that I can recall, except for chewing gum in class or sneaking messages to other classmates.
One could bring a gun to school and leave it in your truck to go hunting later and you most always had a jack knife in your pocket.
When the Bible was taken out of schools that was when you saw a decline in grade scores and problems with discipline, crimes increased.
Bibles neeed to be brought back into schools and read aloud and The Ten Commandsments displayed in every classroom.
If our Founding Fathers were guided by The Word and The Ten Commandments are in the Rotunda in Washington, DC there is no excuse to keep them out of schools.
If the Muslims can have a room to pray, then Christians should be afforded the same.
36 people like this.
Reply 5 - Posted by:
Strike3 11/10/2024 7:44:13 AM (No. 1830883)
The Bible is packed with interesting and valuable history that students would not get anywhere else but it should be voluntary, clergy driven and not on school property. The Left has enough to drive them insane, this would add to their adopted burden of things to protest.
11 people like this.
Reply 6 - Posted by:
Jean123 11/10/2024 7:52:59 AM (No. 1830889)
NO! Separation of church and state. We don't want the left's religion preached in schools so we should not want bible reading either. Let's stick with the pledge of allegiance and academics please!!
38 people like this.
Reply 7 - Posted by:
cartcart 11/10/2024 8:11:13 AM (No. 1830894)
Teach scriptures at home-coupled with personal and family prayer. Most teachers would miss the spiritual things and interpret truthful teachings incorrectly.
16 people like this.
Reply 8 - Posted by:
The Remnants 11/10/2024 8:30:37 AM (No. 1830903)
When I was in school, after prayers, we made the pledge of allegiance to the flag and we always said, "one nation under God". I do not know if the Pledge of Allegiance is still said in grade school and whether or not the children say those words. ( I went to Catholic school.)
11 people like this.
Reply 9 - Posted by:
Californian 11/10/2024 8:55:16 AM (No. 1830921)
Time to reintroduce civics and critical thinking in our schools.
The rest will follow naturally.
26 people like this.
Reply 10 - Posted by:
jalo1951 11/10/2024 8:57:35 AM (No. 1830925)
No, bad idea.
19 people like this.
This is a non-issue. Our country has other problems to deal with..... inflation, open borders and crime.
15 people like this.
Reply 12 - Posted by:
lynngirl122 11/10/2024 9:12:47 AM (No. 1830940)
I'm in the minority here but prayer does not belong in schools. Pray on your own time.
23 people like this.
Reply 13 - Posted by:
readtheBook 11/10/2024 9:17:09 AM (No. 1830944)
The Constitution itself provides the key to solving this problem.
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."
"Congress" is the Federal Government, not the State Government.
At the time of the signing of the Constitution of the United States every state constitution had references to God, some explicitly to Christianity.
Even recorded in Article VII of the Constitution the signing of the date is given as "the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty Seven..."
Who was this "Lord"?
You may say this was just a cultural convention, yet culture is that upon which government rests.
It seems President Trump's proposals regarding school choice are very closely aligned with the original intention of our Constitution and those who signed it.
18 people like this.
Reply 14 - Posted by:
Dodge Boy 11/10/2024 9:24:26 AM (No. 1830952)
Just stick with reciting the Pledge of Allegiance in the morning at the start of the school day and include the "...one nation under God..." part.
20 people like this.
Reply 15 - Posted by:
Rama41 11/10/2024 9:30:48 AM (No. 1830956)
#12. I don't think you're in the minority.
14 people like this.
Reply 16 - Posted by:
Highlander 11/10/2024 9:51:04 AM (No. 1830978)
The reading of God’s Word is a privilege given only to those who believe and have love for Him.
“Do not give what is holy to the dogs; nor cast your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you in pieces.”
10 people like this.
Reply 17 - Posted by:
3XALADY 11/10/2024 10:02:29 AM (No. 1830986)
Started school 1950. Heard Bible verse and said Pledge of Allegiance to start the day. I seem to have come out of it okay.
17 people like this.
Reply 18 - Posted by:
Hazymac 11/10/2024 10:07:34 AM (No. 1830990)
As I was growing up, my parents provided me with the best formal education available at the best schools. The great schools and great teachers played their essential roles in making me who I am. But the best education I ever received was on my own between January and May 1996 when I read the entire KJV Bible from cover to cover. Twenty-eight years later I'm reading the New Living Version cover to cover. Everything you need is in that Book. Reading it all the way through is an education in itself. Maybe I'll live long enough to read ten translations. They're upstairs in the study. Yes, everyone should read the Bible. You can find a multitude of 365 day reading plans online. Just stick to it. You'll be eternally glad you did. Read the Book!
21 people like this.
Reply 19 - Posted by:
Dipi 11/10/2024 10:07:41 AM (No. 1830992)
The only thing that should be done in our schools is the pledge of allegiance. Bible reading and prayer is something that should be done at home by the parents. The schools' job is to teach the students. Anything having to do with religion is a parental responsibility, and not the government.
13 people like this.
Reply 20 - Posted by:
rikkitikki 11/10/2024 11:08:23 AM (No. 1831034)
To #1:
You are living in a bubble of your own making.
The notion that America can remove all vestiges of religion from its public policies is a myth
That's because any govt must adopt a set of laws to prevent total anarchy...you know, to decide who has what rights, and when are those rights violated.
So...pick one...Christianity, secular humanism, nihilism, atheism...but you will pick one, even if only by default, and no matter which one, it will comprise a religion, and you will be required to impose its beliefs on the population.
I favor Christianity, since our current Constitution, Bill of Rights, and entire legal system are based on its absolute truths, and, over the last 250 years, it's produced the greatest country in the history of the planet.
What do you propose to take its place, and what is its track record compared to that?
13 people like this.
Reply 21 - Posted by:
earlybird 11/10/2024 11:20:55 AM (No. 1831048)
I don't agree. Bible reading is for Sunday school at their parents' church and at home. Prayer is an individual rthing, not something to be part of school.
As for disdipline, we had school principals who handled that.
8 people like this.
Reply 22 - Posted by:
DCGIRL 11/10/2024 11:23:30 AM (No. 1831052)
If you want your child to learn the bible in school, then send them to a Christian school. The bible and religion does not belong in public school.
9 people like this.
Reply 23 - Posted by:
Strike3 11/10/2024 11:26:41 AM (No. 1831054)
The most popular and controlling religion in the world is now Islam. Would anybody want the Koran to be read every morning to their children? I didn't think so. Religion is up to the parent(s) until the child is old enough to choose his own path.
10 people like this.
Reply 24 - Posted by:
JackBurton 11/10/2024 11:31:05 AM (No. 1831060)
The Bible is a foundational document for Western Civilization. It should be taught along with Greek and Roman myths about the gods. It's also more historically accurate than a lot of old tales and there is a constant affirmation of its histories coming from archaeologists.
With that said, I just finished re-reading Genesis and there was a lot of illicit sex going on that... well, that I would edit. The ending story of Joseph and his brothers though... brought tears.
8 people like this.
Reply 25 - Posted by:
Strike3 11/10/2024 12:14:27 PM (No. 1831091)
I agree somewhat, #24, although there is NO proof of any of the Greek or Roman gods ever having existed. Thor and Zeus were thought to be the cause of lightning, a bad thing. Mars was the god of war, which has always been with us so there must have been somebody talking man into it because we would not fight amongst ourselves voluntarily, perpetually, over stupid disagreements.
The illicit sex in those times brought on God's destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah and, fortunately for us, God promised never to do that again or the world would be a burnt-out cinder right now. In essence, our bad habits must be blamed on something because it's not our fault.
4 people like this.
Reply 26 - Posted by:
LadyHen 11/10/2024 1:19:59 PM (No. 1831128)
NO! What a can of worms that would open. Every single religion would require the same treatment and where would that put us?
Prayer and reading scripture BY STUDENTS has never been banned in schools. It has been upheld by the USSC numerous times as protected speech.
Teachers however are another matter as they are agents and employees of the State. The last thing I want is a public school teacher teaching my kid about the Bible or prayer. I have seen how liberals co-opt scripture and twist it just as the Satan does in the Bible inside many protestant churches hollowing them out and making the whitewashed tombs. Can you imagine the blasphemy agnostic or even atheist teachers would teach? Teaching children about faith, scripture, and prayer is the job of parents and the Church. And considering most churches can't even teach the Gospel faithfully, this is really really not the job of the State.
9 people like this.
Reply 27 - Posted by:
hershey 11/10/2024 2:13:55 PM (No. 1831160)
Yep...our problems all started when they kicked God out of our schools...
11 people like this.
Reply 28 - Posted by:
NorthernDog 11/10/2024 2:45:35 PM (No. 1831183)
I'd be happy if they just gave Judeo Christian values the respect they deserve. Start by calling that long break around Dec 25th Christmas - Not winter festivus.
9 people like this.
Reply 29 - Posted by:
czechlist 11/11/2024 8:15:25 AM (No. 1831610)
I am aware of school districts which set aside time and provide space for muslim prayers. I don't know why Christians, Jews, Hindi or even Zorastrians should be denied the same.
2 people like this.
Reply 30 - Posted by:
Kate318 11/11/2024 8:19:51 AM (No. 1831615)
Interesting comments by a lot of names I don’t recognize. Just saying’…
I don’t believe any religion should be specifically taught in public schools, unless there is a separate class that addresses all religions in an historical/anthropological/sociological context, and as part of the framework of the US Constitution. HOWEVER, the forbidding of Christianity and Judaism should itself be forbidden, and all students allowed to publicly pray and bear witness. You don’t have to push Judeo-Christian values, but you must allow them.
And, for those of you yammering on about Separation of Church and State, that phrase does not exist anywhere in the US Constituion, nor the Declaration of Independence. The First Amendment does NOT guarantee that the state be free of religion. It mandates that government cannot interfere with religion. Big difference.
3 people like this.
Reply 31 - Posted by:
lindaluka 11/11/2024 9:26:21 AM (No. 1831693)
As much as I value the Bible and prayer, there is no way either would be presented thoughtfully. Some teachers are indoctrinators would and spin everything around and offer their anti-Christian views. Besides, it would open a can of "religious worms" offering all kinds of who knows what.
2 people like this.
Reply 32 - Posted by:
Zigrid 11/11/2024 10:07:12 AM (No. 1831732)
I have a problem with this...religion should not be taught in school...unless it's a Christian school...and President Trump's idea about school choice is an excellent idea...that way parents can choose where to send their kids...my children attended Christian schools and I was happy with the results...NO abortions and happily married for 25-40 years as the Bible taught them...and I'm talking four biological kids and three adopted children...
2 people like this.
Reply 33 - Posted by:
Amoeba 11/11/2024 10:36:55 AM (No. 1831755)
#26, well said. Agree 100%.
1 person likes this.
Reply 34 - Posted by:
NYbob 11/11/2024 10:48:22 AM (No. 1831762)
I'd settle for a competent teaching of our history, the founding fathers fives and thinking and weave that into current civics classes. Then MAYBE we could have a generation that understands the gift they have been given and their responsibility to continue and elevate the American Experiment.
3 people like this.
Reply 35 - Posted by:
vinegrower 11/11/2024 11:10:48 AM (No. 1831780)
Many of you here will disagree with me but I am Catholic and I don't want prayer in school. When prayer in school is brought up it's always with the backing of protestants not any of the other religions. I attended school in the 50's and 60's, in Calif, we had absolutely no prayer in public schools. If you want prayer in school go to a parochial school, that's what I did.
1 person likes this.
Reply 36 - Posted by:
commonsence 11/11/2024 11:14:54 AM (No. 1831782)
a few minutes of silent meditation would be a good compromise! Of course this was already tried and the liberals went insane and the courts struck it down. This current court is not as liberal as prior ones. This would involve a time for spiritual reflection, but no chance of indoctrination.
2 people like this.
No! Make school choice available the way Arizona and some other states have! That avoids constitutional problems and everyone who wants religious education gets it.
1 person likes this.
Reply 38 - Posted by:
Harlowe 11/11/2024 3:49:04 PM (No. 1831979)
In the 1940’s, The Gideons distributed free Bibles to a variety of public venues including public schools. The “Gideons International” was founded for men in 1899 as an Evangelical Christian association to, along with their wives, do the work of the Lord as did a man identified in Scripture as Gideon “who was willing to do exactly what God wanted him to do, regardless of his own judgment as to the plans or results ... Humility, faith, and obedience were his great elements of character.”
Then came Madalyn Murray O’Hair, “an American activist supporting atheism and separation of church and state. In 1963, she founded American Atheists ... she identified as a militant feminist” and “is best known for the Murray v. Curlett lawsuit, which challenged the policy of mandatory prayers and Bible reading in Baltimore public schools, in which she named her first son William J. Murray as plaintiff. ... She fought a war against school prayer and won ... OFFICIAL BIBLE-READING in American public schools in 1963 and onward would cease.”
On August 27, 1995, Madalyn Murray O’Hair, her atheist son and granddaughter (Jon Murray and Robin Murray O’Hair) were kidnapped by three men and taken to San Antonio.” Each family member was strangled in a hotel room, their bodies were chopped up, “loaded into three 55-gallon metal drums, driven to Camp Wood in Real County, Northwest of San Antonio, where they were buried.” It was reported in December 2016 that her son, William Murray” an atheist, had converted to Christianity.
Based on comments posted through the years, it is clear that conservative parents are not pleased with this country’s public education system. Doing away with the Department of Education is allegedly on President-elect Trump’s agenda with the goal of providing the best education possible for American children.
A very astute Ldotter (#27) alluded to this country’s problems having begun when God was taken out of schools. Without any loving, caring, nurturing, religious parental guidance, many children are “left behind” physically, emotionally, morally, and religiously. For some children, the only guidance they get is in school and, until 1963, Bible reading (may have been limited to one verse each day) was their one and only awareness of God. However, today, students are legally being exposed to a variety of perverse behaviors with an aura of those perverse behaviors being acceptable.
With the evaporation of tolerance in today’s society, the very essence of restoring some means of “religion” in public schools inflames otherwise rational people into one excuse after another to refuse to stand firm in the reality that this is the United States of America and there is freedom of religion and prayer should be permitted in public schools even if only through one or two minutes of “silence” for “personal prayer” or for personally-held religious text and read silently by each student.
As concluded by the author: “We need to find creative ways to restore faith in Almighty God to our public educational institutions. It is essential for our return to being a more moral nation. Aren't 60+ years where God can't even ride in the back of the bus sufficiently disgraceful that we need a revision?
“I am afraid that the schools will prove the very gates of hell, unless they diligently labor in explaining the Holy Scriptures and engraving them in the heart of the youth.” ~ Martin Luther (1483-1546)
3 people like this.
Reply 39 - Posted by:
Msquared112 11/11/2024 9:10:01 PM (No. 1832201)
Not yet, There are far more important things to do first, like cleaning out the vipers’ nests in DC, closing the border, opening oil pipelines and talking about nuclear power, removing DEI, stopping men in women’s sports, and overall regaining sanity in America. The Bible and prayers is a little down the road just now
0 people like this.