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The Bundy Ranch Standoff
and Attitudes Toward the State

Reason Magazine, by Brian Doherty

Original Article

Posted By:StormCnter, 4/20/2014 6:05:36 AM

The immediate "crisis" portion of the standoff involving the federal Bureau of Land Management (BLM) and Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy over his cattle grazing on federal land ended last week. Whether this will be end of Bundy´s troubles with the BLM, who have been in court with him over his refusal to pay fees to them for decades, remains to be seen, with the Bundys reporting that they´ve received registered mail from the BLM this week that they haven´t opened yet. I blogged about a lot of the factual background of the conflict here, with links to some relevant court documents. This story


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Reply 1 - Posted by: Spidey, 4/20/2014 6:33:01 AM     (No. 9817528)

Shelia Jackson Lee is allowed to graze in her backyard,so why can´t Mr. Bundy be allowed to graze his cattle in open space?

Why does the government spy on cattle ranchers anyway? Is t some sort of measurement they use to see how much methane is being produced somewhere?Good luck trying to beat the absurdity of the left.Some of these kooks actually believe that dinosaurs farted themselves out of existence.

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Reply 2 - Posted by: chumley, 4/20/2014 8:25:51 AM     (No. 9817596)

Suppose the Mafia decides you have to pay for the use of the sidewalk outside your store. After all, they control the union workers who made the sidewalk, so its only fair that you pay for the sidewalk that brings you business.
All your neighbors pay because it is the easy way out, but you refuse, knowing you will be beat up and probably get some bones broken. The Mafia cannot let a challenge to their power go unanswered.
But instead of just beating you up, the Mafia sends hundreds of soldiers to steal your merchandise and hold everyone in your family at gunpoint while they do it. They know they can do what they want and nobody will stop them. The Don is a complete thug and not at all subtle.
Many of your neighbors side with the Mafia because they already paid and they are afraid. Others join you at gunpoint and vow to fight the Mob if it comes to that.

So how is this different than the Bundy situation? Because we elect the mobsters? Thats not much of a difference.

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Reply 3 - Posted by: littleorby, 4/20/2014 8:46:18 AM     (No. 9817617)

Unless the author is competing with Tevye´s "but, on the other hand . . .," logic (ref: Fiddler on the Roof); then, I suggest he come to some kind of conclusion as to whether or not the BLM was trying to carry out a land grab by Harry Reid et el., then redo his paper: without that conclusion his article is meaningless.

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Reply 4 - Posted by: Pluperfect, 4/20/2014 9:08:35 AM     (No. 9817633)

Except, #3, the writer makes clear from the beginning he has come to no conclusion. His piece is about, as the headline states, attitudes toward the state, not the specifics of the Bundy case.

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Reply 5 - Posted by: littleorby, 4/20/2014 10:07:10 AM     (No. 9817682)

In that case #4, school me as to what would be his purpose for bothering to mention the Bundy case if it were not germane to the thrust of his narrative.

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Reply 6 - Posted by: enuf8, 4/20/2014 10:38:15 AM     (No. 9817713)

# 4 reading the article makes a simple job of discerning on which side of the wall the writer is standing.

That said, some talented investigative reporter needs to dig deep into the Clark County Tax appraisal office files.
Lots of LLCs with no assessed taxes, which properties are adjacent to BLM properties grow in acreage size with BLM "owned" shrinking with no transaction of transfer in the files----this includes the Reid, LLC.
Then, why did the BLM pay $700,000 for a 10 acre plot in the middle of no where? Whose pockets were filled with this transaction. Who lobbied to put a multi-million dollar large road intersection with a major artery and construct a road to "no where"?
The March 14 ground breaking photo of Harry Reid on a plot of land about 35 miles from the Bundy ranch seems to need answers; may answer why the fiasco of the BLM was brought up now. Definitely could stand some digging into the subject.
The road to "no where"----the best and least expensive way (by multi-millions) to connect the plot of land just Happens to cut right through the Middle of the Bundy Owned Property.
Smells a bit stinky here and I don´t think it´s the cow patties or global warming the cows produced.

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Reply 7 - Posted by: Nevadadad46, 4/20/2014 11:13:11 AM     (No. 9817747)

Let us see the changes in America civil disobedience to onerous or evil laws has wrought; Rosa Parks? yeah, but those segregation laws were just wrong! Martin Luther King? Well, yeah, but, you know that´s a race issue and those laws needed to be changed! How about John Brown? What about Thomas Jefferson and his pals? What about President Jackson, himself...refusing to bend to the will of the bankers...and though the bankers won, in the end, in 1929 we came to realize, Jackson was right!

Where do those who understand the power of the state is being used unjustly quit being heroes and become criminals? Some laws and the enforcement of them are just plain wrong! And they need to be stopped regardless of the consequences!

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Reply 8 - Posted by: StormCnter, 4/20/2014 12:14:24 PM     (No. 9817810)

There is useful information in this piece, including the 1998 court ruling against Bundy.


The attorney from New Jersey, Sam Rosado, has an interesting take in the last section of the article, too.

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Reply 9 - Posted by: MDMuskrat, 4/20/2014 12:56:43 PM     (No. 9817845)

#3: I´m with you. As I was reading (with difficulty) the article, I remember thinking, "This guy should have been a politician; he´s writing a lot but he ain´t saying nothin´." Once again, though, it´s clear (if only from his references) which side of the David - Goliath confrontation he´s on. [For some slaves, it was very important not to incur the wrath of the master.]

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Reply 10 - Posted by: OhMy, 4/20/2014 2:01:44 PM     (No. 9817886)

The roots of this standoff are similar to the roots of the country - the declaration of independence includes the standard . . . But when a long train of abuses and userpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them (we the people) under absolute Despotism.
The government can take any property whether under Kelo or a bunch of laws to tax, or save the turtles, or whatever. Bundy is the last Rancher standing! All the safeguards which should protect the citizens from out of control government are broken. The constitution is shredded. The law itself becomes a pretext for the powerful like Reid to do whatever they want, give away whatever they want to get cash from the Chi-coms. The law no longer deserves respect because it is a species of violence. Bundy got support, despite his personal flaws, because many people have experienced the run away lawlessness of government. Why are the wealthiest parts of the country in the counties around the capitol? Because Big Government has more wealth than the productive parts of the population which are spread across the whole country. Big Government rapes the whole population to enrich itself. Reagan said it a long time ago. Government is not the solution it is the problem. Obama demonizes greedy wealthy people. He means those who earn what they have in the private sector not the ones who get much more that they could ever really earn from government.

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Reply 11 - Posted by: Susannah, 4/20/2014 2:22:13 PM     (No. 9817899)

Since Bundy doesn´t acknowledge the existence of the U.S. government (the Nevada constitution, adopted in 1865, does, and acknowledges primary allegiance to it), I assume he doesn´t:

1. Drive on federal highways
2. Use the United Stares postal service
3. Use Medicare
4. Collect Social Security
5. Accept farm subsidies
6. Vote in national elections

Seriously, folks. Government overreach is a huge problem. But it´s not going to be solved by getting behind this crackpot and some other crackpots playing cowboy guerrilla.

Anyway, where were the "militias" when Susette Kelo and Michael Christofaro were having property they actually owned stolen from them?

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Reply 12 - Posted by: Rakasha, 4/20/2014 4:07:25 PM     (No. 9817972)

#11, I do not see anywhere where Bundy has not acknowledged the existence of the U.S. Government. He has merely denied their authority to arbitrarily change his lease agreement and to take his property (money and cattle, not the land).

The ´People´ did not physically show up for Kelo and Christofaro because at that time we believed that we still had a government and a Supreme Court that understood the Constitution. We expected things to be settled through proper channels - checks and balances - the way it was written.

As more and more People become aware that our government does not believe it answers to us, I think we will see more and more of them, ´´militias´´ if you like, showing up to such events.

Don´t forget, Thomas Paine and Samuel Adams were crackpots too...

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Reply 13 - Posted by: Susannah, 4/20/2014 4:32:19 PM     (No. 9817988)

Sorry you missed it, #12. Bundy said, on Dana Loesch´s radio show, during an interview: "I don´t even recognize the existence of the U.S. government." He´s been widely quoted.

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Reply 14 - Posted by: OhMy, 4/20/2014 6:06:02 PM     (No. 9818057)

Clearly what is at issue is not the existence of the US government but the constitutional legitimacy of it. If Bundy uses emotional language it is understandable. He must surely know of the existence of the US government when it sends snipers to aim guns at him! You say #11 that government overreach is a serious problem. I am sure the founders had dealings, similar to the 6 things you enumerate, with the King or the government before they made the declaration that it had become illegitimate. Admit it - you are not the least bit concerned by government overreach! Tell us what a great guy Harry Reid is!

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Reply 15 - Posted by: Rakasha, 4/20/2014 6:31:11 PM     (No. 9818083)

Thank you for putting me onto that, #13. I found the audio from Dana´s show. It sounds like the quote:

I abide by all of Nevada state laws. But I don´t recognize the United States government as even existing.

was from a different interview as well as being isolated from any other comment he might have made.

Listening to him in the interview with Dana, he clearly understands and acknowledges that there is a United States government. It seems likely that this widely used quote was simply a misstatement about who he believes has jurisdiction.

But that doesn´t make him out to be a nut so that he can be firmly placed in the AikinAngleO´DonnellMourdock box and dismissed, does it?

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Reply 16 - Posted by: Rakasha, 4/20/2014 6:36:25 PM     (No. 9818086)

Sorry, but in case anyone else wants to listen, here is the link:


The quote in question is in the opening, just before the interview begins.

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