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Calif. gun store owner to feds:
No, you can’t have my customer list

Daily Caller, by Alex Pappas

Original Article

Posted By:MissMolly, 3/15/2014 3:31:23 PM

A gun store owner in California has a message for the feds: No, you can’t force me to turn over my customer list to you. Fox 5 in San Diego reported that Dimitrios Karras, the Oceanside, Calif. owner of Ares Armor, said Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms department agents have threatened to raid his business if he doesn’t hand over a list of all customers who purchased an item for building an AR-15. The ATF, according to Karras, wants the names of 5,000 customers who bought a certain 80 percent lower receiver, something the feds say is illegal. Gun stores that have sold

      


Post Reply  

Reply 1 - Posted by: thewarden, 3/15/2014 3:42:48 PM     (No. 9770181)

Good!

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Reply 2 - Posted by: miceal, 3/15/2014 3:44:55 PM     (No. 9770184)

So it begins.....

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R-G6-LC
  


 
Reply 3 - Posted by: Jethro bo, 3/15/2014 3:47:23 PM     (No. 9770188)

This is how it starts. Civil disobedience against fascist, dictatorial state goobernment. More power to the people. Next once arrested, a jury needs to nullify the laws. We need to Start a peaceful revolution. Hopefully, the full blown fascist like Obambi, Reid and Piglosi will not start a hot revolution.

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Reply 4 - Posted by: ruready?, 3/15/2014 3:53:39 PM     (No. 9770200)

Connecticut is rebelling against the state gun registration law
The Wyoming guy who built the stock pond is rebelling against the EPA
The millennials are rebelling against Obamacare
Trey Gowdy and the House are rebelling against the "a pen and a phone"

Maybe #2 and #3 are right.


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Reply 5 - Posted by: bkt23, 3/15/2014 4:23:30 PM     (No. 9770222)

Hold up a tick. The ATF was interested in what are known as "80% lowers" - the lower receiver of AR-15 rifles that are only 80% complete. You need to mill out more material to make it the equivalent of a stripped lower which can then be assembled into a rifle.

By legal definition, these 80% lowers are NOT firearms. That´s the point of making them only 80% complete. Given this, the ATF has absolutely no jurisdiction. They´re after customer lists because there is no corresponding 4473 form or other documentation that could be used for de facto registration for these items.

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Reply 6 - Posted by: Doc Obiwan, 3/15/2014 4:43:23 PM     (No. 9770230)

#5 is correct. 80% receivers are, by the BATFE´s own regulations, not illegal.

What raises my curiosity is that they seem to be specifying a certain company´s 80 percent receivers. That´s not stated explicitly but that seems to be what the article hints at. So who is the company, and why?

I think there´s something more here than usual BATFE overreach. Which, of course, is quite enough all by itself.

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Reply 7 - Posted by: craige, 3/15/2014 5:07:02 PM     (No. 9770251)

I remember a fellow who sawed off a shotgun barrel, for someone. He came under the scrutiny of the feds, and lost big time. His wife and son died in the raid.

Randy Weaver´s advice, is cooperate.

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Reply 8 - Posted by: shamrock, 3/15/2014 5:56:26 PM     (No. 9770287)

Really #7, by your thinking, George Washington should have co-operated with the Brits.

Being a surrender monkey is not an option for a free people.

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Reply 9 - Posted by: MDMuskrat, 3/15/2014 5:57:01 PM     (No. 9770288)

Kudos, OP, for bringing this to our attention.

#7: Your post is worthy of note, too. (Gruff voice: "So help me, I´ll rape you!" Cowardly, Quisling-type voice: "So rape me, I´ll help you.")

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Reply 10 - Posted by: Manitouman, 3/15/2014 6:15:56 PM     (No. 9770297)



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Reply 11 - Posted by: Manitouman, 3/15/2014 6:22:10 PM     (No. 9770301)

#7:
Mr. Weaver did not saw the barrel off that shotgun. In fact he refused to handle it when they wanted him to entrap their erstwhile target.

That´s why they came after him - to teach him a lesson because he refused to do what they wanted - which was illegal.

Remember he won his case because the government was wrong. Yes he lost his family, but he didn´t start that fight. They fired the first shots from concealment.

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Reply 12 - Posted by: Italiano, 3/15/2014 6:45:00 PM     (No. 9770313)

Holder´s Gestapo. Think that they´ll stop here?

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Reply 13 - Posted by: terry_tr6, 3/15/2014 6:46:03 PM     (No. 9770315)

lets see, did any of the people responsible for Ruby ridge get any punishment?
Did anyone in LE involved in Waco ever suffer any punishment (other that getting shot by friendly fire??
Has anyone responsible for Fast and Furious suffered any punishment?
Has anyone in the IRS been held accountable for the persecution of conservative groups?

Am i starting to see a pattern here?

Go read Unintended Consequences



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Reply 14 - Posted by: Patchy groundfog, 3/15/2014 7:36:29 PM     (No. 9770356)

Is it a raid if the agents´ arrival time is known in advance? Or is it simply jackbooted thugs with official sanction intimidating the citizenry?

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Reply 15 - Posted by: craige, 3/16/2014 8:36:36 AM     (No. 9770753)

Wikipedia has a good article on Randy Weaver.

Once again: it is not a good idea to get into a shootout with federal law enforcement. Fight it out in court.

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